Segestria sp.? <=

[Raffaele Falato]

Gorgoglione, Province of Matera, Basilicata, Southern Italy.

Discovery date: December 12, late morning.
Habitat: 800 m - on the outskirts of the village, on the outer wall of a building. Presence of varied vegetation.
Size: about 2mm.

Hello,
is this spider a very young specimen of Segestria senoculata or is the species not yet determinable?
Thanks.
Raf


seg.jpg (32.48 KB . 397x491 - angeschaut 168 Mal)

[Jonathan Neumann]

Hallo Raf,

for me this is Segestria bavarica.

lg,
jonathan

[Raffaele Falato]

Ciao Jonathan,
what do you base your hypothesis on?

I would not agree too much: according to the wiki S. bavarica should have abdominal spots clearly separated by a slight center line, while S. senoculata should have interconnected oval spots, like my spider.

But I don't know if these characteristics are present in young specimens.

Raf

[Jonathan Neumann]

What is the microclimate there?
According to my experience Segestria bavarica likes dry and warm places and Segestria senoculata likes cold and wet/damp places.

Oh and in South Europe there is the gian Segestria florentiana, where the juveniles looks like Segestria bavarica.

LG,
Jonathan

[Raffaele Falato]

The animal stood on the outer wall of the gymnasium, which is the last building in the village, then the countryside begins and a long boundary wall that runs along the road. There is also the presence of water (a canalized stream).
That day was cloudy and cold, with no sun.

Precisely because it is a young specimen I have given this title to the thread.

[Carsten Wieczorrek]

Hallo,
hm, ich bin ja definitiv kein Fachmann, habe aber in meinem Gartenhaus bavarica und senoculata.
Meine bavaricas sehen so aus, wie Raf es beschrieben hat: mit deutlich getrennten Mittelflecken. Passt bei mir (und Köln ist ja immer nass und kalt) eher zu senoculata.
Allerdings sehen die bei mir auch etwas anders aus: so extrem geringelte Beine habe ich noch nicht gesehen.
Grüße
Carsten

[Raffaele Falato]

... habe aber in meinem Gartenhaus bavarica und senoculata.

Dear Carsten, lucky you.
I haven't found any yet.
Maybe I look in the wrong places, and hardly ever in the evening / night.

... so extrem geringelte Beine habe ich noch nicht gesehen.

Consider that the spider is little more than a sling (just 2mm compared to how much it can grow).
Have you already seen a bavarica / senoculata in a similar age stage?

Raf

[Raffaele Falato]

Good morning.

Encouraged by Carsten's hypothesis, I searched for photos of young specimens of senoculata on specialized sites.

So, premised that also from the photos on the web young bavarica specimens always have separate abdominal spots, I found two photos (Biolib.cz and welokee.nl - which I think is the site of a Dutch user of this forum) of young specimens of senoculata like my spider, they also have very ringed legs.

But then I read a thread on the French site insecte.org where a very young specimen, like mine, was identified only in the genus.

At this point, as a precaution, I would file my spider as Segestria sp.

Or does senoculata deserve a cf.?

Happy 2021 everyone.
Raf

[Tobias Bauer]

Based on my personal interest: Is S. florentina common at your place? In Istria, S. florentina lives nearly everywhere in synanthropic habitats, and in winter, you find their offspring (adults are mostly found in mid- to late summer), with exactly this size, nearly everywhere.

Tobias

[Raffaele Falato]

I don't know, Tobias, and I have no idea. I have never gone out hunting in the evening / night. And so far I haven't looked for their webs.

[Jonathan Neumann]

A spider hunt at night is heavily recomended!Or is it too dangerous at your area?

lg,
jonathan

[Raffaele Falato]

And why should it be dangerous, Jonathan?
I simply dedicate the other half of the day to my family (I go out hunting at 8/9 and I come home at 1 pm) and if it's not cold also to friends and beer. Obviously if I don't have processes to study or clients to receive in the study.
But this year I am determined to go out for a few evenings / nights, the village is full of old walls, empty houses and other interesting environments in the dark.
Raf

[Jonathan Neumann]

And why should it be dangerous, Jonathan?

Because there are regions on earth were you should not leave your flat/house/property after sunset, because you get easily robbed. And for your region I dont know how the situation is, but obviously nothing to worry about

But this year I am determined to go out for a few evenings / nights, the village is full of old walls, empty houses and other interesting environments in the dark.

Than I highly recommend to do the family duty on the mornign shift to have some spider free time at night. Believe me, you will have an insight into a completely different world:), especially your mentioned old walls with alot crevices. A huge variety of arthropod species can be expected there.

lg,
jon

[Raffaele Falato]

Hey Jonathan, Italy is a safe country where you can safely go out in the evening, robberies and thefts happen in Italy as in Germany and in the rest of the world, if we have to live with this fear ...
And then I'm a lawyer, in Italy you don't steal from thieves' homes. 

Yes, I will definitely do night hunting this year.

Greetings from Southern Italy.
Raf

[Tobias Bauer]

The only thing you get usually robbed of in Italy is your eating discipline and diet plan, because of the great local cuisine.

Tobias